New Club Last Night

In the spirit of openness and completeness, I ought to say that two nights ago while laying next to my husband in bed, I said, "I want to stop swinging." And I wasn't kidding. I have had no problem with the morals of it. I was, in that moment, worried that it had occupied too much of my psyche and that of my husband. Kind of like of we were chronic knitting aficionados and all we did was do that and nothing else. I was worried that we would progress to forgetting about our kids and our budget and food and just knit/swing. My husband kindly and correctly said, OK. I knew that he was sincere, but also that he would be shocked and that we'd need to discuss it more. But he said that he loved me more than anything and that he'd do anything I wanted. In that moment, I had been having somewhat of a panic attack, and his acceptance of my decision let me feel calm and sleep. And so we did.

The next morning was just a normal morning. We said our usual prayers together, the kids went off to school and he went off to work. I really think that if we never went swinging again, we'd be fine.

But then I got to thinking how much we both enjoyed those occasions, and I realized that if we could just keep them to occasions, then there would be no problem. I do enjoy the attention and the excitement. I just don't want it to be the major theme of our lives. Even though those who read my journal entries would think that we do nothing other than swing. But understand that we don't have other hobbies: we don't hunt, we don't shop much, we don't golf or go boating or go to a lot of movies. We love being with our kids and doing family things, but that's about it. Our only other hobby is traveling to meet people and go to social events and maybe have sex with others. This next day, I changed my mind back. I wanted to keep swinging for now.

I think the reason that this came up now was because we were headed to Denver the next day to visit relatives and go to a new swinger club. Whenever we go to a club event, I get a little anxious and excited about what could happen. During sex with just the two of us, we often describe a gang-bang fantasy, but I don't know if I want that in real life. I don't like the idea of not being in control. I want to control the room and the pace and who goes and comes where. My husband and I discussed this again during our trip here to Denver. I re-explained my desires (which he already knew and accepted). So when we got to the club, we were quite excited. We'd texted with a few couples in the days prior, so we were hoping that someone would be waiting and excited to see us. We went in and paid the membership dues. Someone then came up to me and introduced himself. He was the husband of one of the couples we had been texting. We took the official tour of the club and then got a soda and went over to them. We re-introduced ourselves. I was wearing high-heels, a short dress that barely covered me, and nothing else. We sat down and talked to them for about 30 minutes and got to know everything about them: their background, how they met, their interests, etc. We talked about what we thought of the club and the people there. I purposely let it slip out at an appropriate time in the conversation that I'd be happy to "do" either of them. It was a fun and flirty conversation. Just then another couple came over and butted themselves in the conversation, so we four had to talk to them. After a few minutes, I said to all of them, but looking at the first two, "we're going to go to a play room, if anyone wants to join us." Joe and I stood up and went to the play area. It looked like our friends got trapped, so Joe and I played hard, vigorous, and loudly with each other. (I can get noisy. It's really not intentional. Joe says that it's super erotic). Just as we'd finished my 10th orgasm, the couple came in to apologize and tell us that they'd love to play with us another time. I got dressed, we hugged them goodbye, and then left. It was a great evening of great sex and making new friends. They later emailed us their phone number and told us to contact them the next time we're in town for a date.

We're now off the spend the rest of the weekend with the relatives. (They think that we went to a dinner and a movie last night. I hope they don't ask for too many details). Shhh.

Writing a Craigslist Ad

Here's quick little lesson on what I think is important when writing an ad on Craigslist when looking for other swingers.

First, don't get defensive or threatening.  Posts get flagged and removed all the time for who-knows what reason.  Don't let it get to you.  Sometimes I think that those companies who post fake ads flag the really good ads (like mine) because they don't want real competition.  Be prepared to write 2-3 similar ads and repost them when one gets flagged by another user.

An ad with a cropped photo gets tons more attention.  If you post 2-3 ads, don't use the same photo multiple ads--people will recognize that you're posting multiple times, then flag all your ads.

HWP means height and weight proportionate.  If you show photos of both of you, you don't need to state the obvious.  If you don't show photos, you should list your height and weight, you could also say how fit you are, but be honest.  We do post our real ages, but may change them by a year or two in a second ad.

DDF means drug and disease free.  I used to think, who would post anything other than this?  But then I saw someone recently post that they are both HSV positive with rare outbreaks.  I appreciated the honesty.  If condoms are must, say so.

I think the best thing is to write intelligently.  This can get hard after your tenth ad.  If it sounds rushed, desperate  and defensive ("don't flag me man!"), then who wants to date that?

In the title, we keep it simple and straight forward "Couple for Couple", or "Same-room Soft-swap on Saturday", or "This Friday Downtown Girl-on-Girl"

We like to express our desires in the ad: "we have a room at a nice hotel for Friday night, and we're looking for a couple to meet up with.  Let's meet for dinner and then assuming we all click, we'll go up to the room to play.  We enjoy same-room full-swap."

We often add that I'm bisexual and he's straight, and that we're non-smokers.  We also say that "we're up for just about anything other than pain."  (After a few emails back and forth, we may say that we have a profile on some of the swinger sites, but many couples are skiddish about being urged to go to a website--they may think it's a scam to get them to give out their credit-card information.)

Express your desire for photos.  We often say, "please send photos and we'll do the same.  No genital shots please.  Rated G are great."  I hate it when guys send photos of their penis and nothing else.  I really don't care about penis size, and I don't want to play with a couple who thinks that's their most interesting feature.

We usually conclude with a commitment to have the two women "voice verify" once we all see each others photos and interests.  There's nothing worse than spending days exchanging emails just to discover that they're not going to ever talk on the phone and meet.  Once you know you want to meet them, get on the phone with them.

As a farce, we once wrote an ad that was the epitome of junk ads and all that is bad about Craigslist.  It got a lot of responses from people who enjoyed the irony.

"We're a middle-aged couple who says that we're 21. I'm a hostile homophobic woman with short dull hair, bra size 46A, quite obese, 4'11". I gag often. My husband is an effeminate reclusive with a small penis  (see the 10 photos below), but he's in really good shape. (Round is a shape). We never shave and rarely bathe, so we keep that musky animalistic aura that we know you love. We say we do full-swap, but we'll change our minds frequently during the night.  We've had most STDs and we hate condoms, so you don't have to worry about giving us anything new. We bring drama to most encounters, and expect you to watch it when it happens. It's likely that one of us will freak out at something and storm out, and the other will get drunk and sullen and not leave without telling you about all the other bad experiences we've had. Did we mention that we can't host, and we don't have a car, so you'll have to pick us up and let us spend a night or two in your guest room until you lend us cab fare, which we'll claim to repay at our next play-date, to which we'll no-show. We can voice verify, but whenever you call, I'll be at work, so you'll only ever talk to my husband. We can send pictures, but they're not of us. Please send us photos of you so we can send them to others and claim them as our own. When you reply to this email, don't expect an intelligible response because it will only be a robot responding.  You'll then need to give me your credit card information so I can show you my fake photos on an overseas porn site.  And don't flag this ad, because I'm real."

If you're going to post on CL, you should create an email address that you can use just for this purpose.  It will get tons of spam.

Also, know that half of the responses you get to your ad will be fakes.  You'll have to learn for yourself how to know the real ones from the fakes.  Once you start replying to them, you'll learn.  The good fakes will keep you hooked for at least 2-3 exchanges.  You'll figure out that they're robots when they don't respond to your specific questions.  Some guys will just want to share photos or webcam.  Some people require that a code word be put in the subject line of any replies, but that could weed out some hot, lazy people.  We prefer to get ALL the responses and then we'll reply to those we think are real.  We respond best to those who send photos in the first reply.  We'll say, "your photo gets ours."  For the most part, we don't reply to any email unless there's a photo, especially if we put a photo in our ad.  If they send a face photo, we reply with a photo (cropped or full-face).

Typical Date

We sure are writing a lot today.  I just saw what Joe wrote while I was writing this.  It's pretty common to have a couple back out of a date a day or two before, so it's best to not put all your eggs in one basket.  We would never promise two couples that we'd meet and then cancel one of them, but it's not unheard of to tell one couple "we don't yet know if we'll be free that night, but we'd like to keep chatting with you in case we can get free and if you're still available."  That way, you don't burn a bridge with a hot couple by saying, "no thanks, we picked someone else and we're not choosing you" and then at the last minute you call them back and say, "hey, the first couple bailed on us, so are you still available?"  I mention all this because this is a copy of the email that I just wrote to our backup couple.  They asked us what we like in an evening, and I thought it worth posting here.

We kind of like meeting over dinner somewhere and getting to know each other.  It's nice for us women to talk on the phone first.  Usually by taking on the phone and reading each other's profiles, we kind of know that we have the same boundaries.  At dinner, if everyone is having fun, then we go up to the hotel room.  If at dinner, someone isn't feeling it, then we just say so, but so far it's never happened, but if it did, we wouldn't take offense.  Up in the room, we can order dessert and keep chatting.  Then we find a way to make it to the bedroom and us women undress and get cozy or we two take a bath together.  (I orgasm easily and often).  Then we invite the guys to join us on the bed and we women move back and forth between our guys--maybe I give oral to my husband while your husband does me from behind.  I have to be honest: my husband has a hard time holding back from cuming once he goes in another woman.  It only takes a couple of minutes of thrusting.  That's why he makes sure that the other woman has had as many orgasms from his mouth, fingers, toys, my mouth, my fingers, our double-ended dildo between us, and you husband's cock, before he cums in you.  We sometimes enjoy anal sex, but we've never tried it with another couple and we'd never be pushy about it.  Usually after I've come 10 times with you and your husband, and then my husband cums once with you, we sit back and relax for a few minutes and then 10 minutes later, he's ready for a final round with either you or me, and I'm always good for another 10 unless I've been contorted into a pretzel too much already.  Then everyone sort of gets dressed and chats and laughs and basks in the glow before hugging good night.

Joe here.  A couple of days ago, she and I had talked about setting up a date.  We posted an ad and watched the replies roll in.  In our opinion, there's a good way and a bad way to write a swinger ad.  But the best thing is to include photos, cropped photos, and don't show your crotch.  Any way, we'd had a good deal of responses to our ad, and we'd been chatting online with a few of these couples.  Then just about an hour ago, we got an email from the first couple who we'd full-swapped with in July 2011 (see the post below).  They saw our ad on Craigslist and wanted to know if we wanted to play with them.  We did have a great time with them the first time because it was the first time for us.  But Christy felt a little jealous about the way that I was touching the other woman's knee after I had sex with her.  Christy wasn't jealous about me having had sex with her, but with the way I touched her knee.  Weird, but I understood.  So we didn't really try to play with them again.  And when I got the email today, I was just going to ignore it.  But I just mentioned it to Christy, just now and then went on to mention some other people who had also emailed us.  I then got called to the backyard by the kids.  Just a moment later, I got a text from Christy which says, 

"I have been thinking about it and decided we should play with ______ and ______.  It's hot that they want us this much and kind of cute that she has a crush on you.  It's making me wet to think about; as long as I'm the alpha!!"

Of course, I quickly wrote them back and we set it up!

Black Friday

I refuse to go out shopping today.  It's so much better to sit home and find all the deals on Amazon online.  Yesterday was a lot of fun with all the relatives over at my house cooking together, and the one relative who was dressed most like a skank was not me!  I'm so deep in the closet, no one would ever guess.

The other reason why it's good for me to be at the computer is that I can cruise the swinger websites: Kasidie, SDC, Swingular, and Craigslist (I don't like SLS--they're HUGE, but I just can navigate their messy site).  We're looking for a date.  Now that we've being doing this for a while, we've gotten a bit picky.  We won't just jump into the sack with anyone.  It's not that we're looking for a super hot couple, cause heaven knows that's not us either.  But we would like some nice.  I don't like facial hair, and they have to not look like snobs, and they shouldn't be super old.  And best of all, they have to be able to communicate.  I hate getting those emails from the guy that says "We r  at hilton  till 8 4 and  find us  Shes tight  IM huge!!"  That's actually an email that I got after I answered a Craigslist ad.  Needless to say, I neither understood it nor responded, even though he was smoking hot!!  I actually am turned on by a guy's brain and kindness.

Anyway, in addition to thinking about us getting naked on a bed with another couple and doing it every which way, it's time to start planning the Christmas holiday.  I've got to think about getting the guest room ready (again) for the next round of visitors, and deciding if we're going to take everyone to Soldier's Hollow for sledding or maybe somewhere else for snowmobiling.

If you've never seen this video about swinging, it's great:

Becoming a Swinger

Getting the Itch

We've been to a few parties over the past year, but we haven't really had a nice little hook-up with another couple in a while.  We're setting aside a date in the near future so we can see about arranging a date with another couple.  We've got our profile on all the good swinger sites, but it seems like we just see the same local profiles on there over and over and don't get much action there.  Even though it sounds cheap, Craigslist really is the way to go for finding another couple.  You've just got to be able to wade through the robots and make sure you're talking to a real person.  It took us a good year to figure out how to make Craigslist work for us.  I ought to teach a class on that.  Once you know the techniques, it just takes a lot of quick emails and sifting through everybody.  But once you do your homework, then it's just narrowing them down.  Reminds me of the finding pool, the teaching pool, and then the conversion pool.  We've already got four good couples in the pool tonight after just a few hours of trying while watching TV.  

Just Keeps Topping the Last One

Just driving back home from an amazing weekend in Las Vegas.  We had a wonderful swinger weekend in the Grand Lakeview suite of the Bellagio hotel.  There were about 20 of us who ended up having an orgy. I’ll never forget the song “Lights” by Ellie Goulding.  Two of the women at the party were also professional strippers.  One of them gave the most erotic lap dance to that song.  It was amazing because it was real.  She really was feeling it.  And then she made out with me.  So HOT!!  Before the evening was over, I’d ridden the cocks of two guys and watched my husband screw a woman and then get blown (and swallowed) by her.  There were a lot more details, but that’s the summary.  I don’t know how we could ever top something like that.

Chilaxing

Someone recently emailed me saying that he missed my updates on my blog.  No one should mistake a temporary absence for a complete disappearance.  We're still here doing our thing.  As of late, "our thing" has been working, raising kids, cleaning house, serving in the Church and serving our neighbors, getting ready for back-to-school, car repair, and all the other basic things that everyone else does.  Some people we know who swing* seem to do it every weekend or two.  That's not us.  We have kids and things that are more important, so we only play when we've planned for it far in advance.  But don't worry, there will be more to write about in the future.  We have things planned.

*Despite the name of this blog, we don't like to think of ourselves as "swingers".  We "swing" or "play with others" - just like all people who bowl are not bowlers.

Sex Party in a New City

Wow!  Had an amazing weekend!  We tried out a new city.  We took the drive to a major metropolitan area west of here that is much more happening than Happy Valley.  Over the years we've met some great people from various locations and they invited us to come to their city to have an event.  We hosted this one.  It was about 20 people in a hotel room sitting around and chatting and getting to know one another.  The women started getting frisky with one another and pulling out sex toys.  Then the guys were invited to jump in and play.  By the end of the evening there was a mass of naked people in the middle of the room having sex with whomever!  It was a classic orgy!  By the end of the evening, there were condom wrappers everywhere!  Absolutely amazing.  And there were a lot of photos taken.  Too bad that I can't show them on here.  Where else can you have sex with someone and then afterward say, "please remind me your name."  As always, everyone was very polite and gracious.  No one was pushy or coercive at all.  At the end of the evening, the clothes went back on, we all hugged and kissed goodbye and that was it.  We departed feeling very rejuvenated.

Yet Another Swinger Party!

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Lori's Story (Part 2)

For those who have been waiting for the rest of Lori's story, here it is.  She just emailed it to me.  See below for part 1.

I thought that I could just have a boyfriend to keep my exhusband at bay.  A boyfriend like I used to have in college.  Go out, date, maybe a good night kiss.  But I quickly found out they didn't exist.  For the year I was going through my divorce, I wasn't allowed to attend any LDS Singles events.  I was even booted off one of the online dating sites because I was honest and said my divorce wasn't finished yet.  I made some good LDS friends online, but they were all too far away to date.

But I quickly found out that non-LDS guys wanted more than a kiss goodnight.  And my resistance was soooo  low.  One thing would lead to another, and even if we stopped short of actual sex, I was still hating myself after.  I would drop that guy and try to find another, with the same results.  Even when I decided I could live with that, the guy wouldn't understand where it needed to stop, and we would end up going all the way.

I went to my bishop, and explained I kept trying, and falling, and just couldn't win this addiction.  I was put on probation.  I was told he was giving me time to get it together.  And that is where things stayed.

I finally was officially divorced and started attending singles events.  But this really didn't help. Single Adult guys are remarkably evasive.  Especially to a newly divorced woman with kids that needed a husband.  Not even casual dates materialized.   At least not with anyone I felt safe with.  The only good way out would have been to get married again to the first guy that came along, and believe me, I had many chances, but I just couldn't be with someone who was not right for me or my kids.  But I was so lonely.  I didn't want to fall back into that trap with one night stands.  Eventually I settled with one guy, a non-member, but a Friend with Benefits.  Someone who I could be with when things got really bad.  But someone who had other girls he was seeing and did not want a committment from me.  This left me free to live my own life.  Attend church and singles activities, accept any dates that came up, and not be tied down.

This went on for a while.  But occasionally my friend would try a relationship, and I was not one to cheat with him, even if those promises meant nothing to him.  If the girlfriend lasted long enough, I would end up getting in trouble again.  I didn't want that, so I started looking for other options.

Along this time, I also read "The Sin 'Next to Murder' " https://www.sunstonemagazine.com/pdf/143-34-43.pdf I had been wondering how I could be such a bad person, but still be recieving all this inspiration from the Lord regarding jobs he had for me in the singles program. I realized I was not a bad person, God still loved me, and understood. I began to realize that adultery and fornication really were two different things, and the one was not nearly as serious. I still tried to be as good as possible, but felt I could stay active in the church without feeling condemned.  I didn't want to fall away from the church, but I did realize that just because one man thought something and taught it as doctrine, didn't mean it came from Heavenly Father.  I was  supposed to ponder and pray and decide on my own.  I pretty much decided when in doubt, I would go back to what Joseph Smith taught.  And he did say that there were many things of this world that he couldn't tell us yet, that would cause us to fall away from the church.  I think this is because so many people brought what they believed from their own churches into ours, that if we differed too radically, they couldn't believe it.

At this time I really started looking at polygamy.  I was starting to understand it.  After all, I had a sudo-boyfriend that I couldn't be jealous of, even caring for him like I did.  I was finally understanding how a woman could allow her husband to have more than one wife.  I was also seeing that if a woman and man (Mary and John) had children under the temple covenant, and then John died, and this happened with another sealed family (Susan and Steve) and then Susan died, and then Mary and Steve got married (sealed) and had kids this could cause problems in the next life. After all, Mary and Steve still loved their first spouse.  But if the couples could accept polygamy and share, Mary could be with both John and Steve, and John could be with both Susan and Mary, and everyone could be happy.  Radical thinking, I know.  Not something most Mormons like to imagine.

I had never gotten along with the girls in my high school.  And only made a few girl friends once I was married (having given up all my guy friends at that time like a good wife).  So girls still terrified me in some ways.  I wanted to overcome that.  The scriptures told us we needed to be able to accept that "new and everlasting covenant" (i.e. polygamy) in order to make it to the celestial kingdom.  Not live it necessarily, but at least understand and accept it.  How in the world was one supposed to do that?

I decided that I should try it.  Find a woman who was willing to share her man, and discover what it was all about.  I can't remember now exactly how it came about, but I began talking to couples who were looking for that "unicorn".  The single woman to join them.  But it solved my problem.  They didn't want someone who would destroy their relationship.  I was free to live my own life and leave if I found someone with whom I wanted a relationship.  To me, I had to care for them, it had to mean something, too.  The whole point was I didn't want one night stands.  Eventually I found a man who was not controlling, and his committed partner who was active in her church and easy to get along with.  Not being married, I didn't even have to question if it was adultery or not.  She even had LDS swinger friends.   We hit it off.  I remember the first night, we had a nice dinner at their house, and took time to get to know each other.  I ended up staying.  When we began, she asked what I wanted to do, and I said, "No offense, (to the man), but I know I am ok with guys, I need to see if I can do this with a woman too."  And she said, "No problem" and leaned forward to kiss me.  It was just like kissing a guy.  I was not attracted really to either of them, but I enjoyed our times together.  There was no stress, no jealousy, just enjoyment, love, and pleasure.  They are happy for me when I am in a relationship, we will always be friends.  I imagine when it is the way it is supposed to be, this is the way polygamy should be.

........

It was very hard for me at one time to understand why the Lord would tell me to marry someone knowing I would end up in divorce.  I almost went inactive then, and obviously almost did several times since.  But I have always remained faithful and tried to make the best choice that was available to me.  The lesser of two evils, so to speak.  I don't feel that the Lord has penalized me for any of my choices.  I continued to work as hard as I could following the inspiration he was sending me, and I have made tremendous advances that have helped many singles in the church.  But I felt all along that he was preparing me for something else.  I told him I didn't want that first trial again, that he needed to find something else for me.  This time I wanted to marry someone I really LOVE, not just the person He picked for me, that I needed to help.

Right now, I am in a relationship with a wonderful LDS guy I have had a crush on for a long time.  I just told him my story.  And he told me his.  He is Bi-Sexual.  And struggled all his life with the Church's teachings and the prejudice that exists against him.  It is my turn to help him.  Everything I have gone through in my life has prepared me to be a support for him.  The Lord knew what he was doing this entire time, and even though I couldn't see it in these Middle Moments, all will work out in the end if we will just listen and obey those promptings, even the ones no one else can understand.

I don't know if this is the end of my story, but maybe it is a new beginning.

Nasty Sex Club

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